johnmatilda
Legend Member
Kudos for surviving that long. Hats off to you mate.
Happy Wife Happy Life
- Thread starter BlackDagger_Au
- Start date
johnmatilda
Legend Member
Most young men haven't yet swallowed the red pill and are unaware of the pitfalls of co-habitation/defacto and marriage. Girls from a very young age are taught that they should be wary of boys/men (rightly or wrongly) but no one teaches our boys about women and what over 50% of them will endure and that co-habitation/defacto/marriage is the involuntary transfer of wealth from men to women.
Fathers, uncles, grandfathers, spread the word and educate our boys.
John Smithl
Legend Member
That's such a sad outlook mate. I've been married a few times. Yes the end is sad and involves sharing assets but they deserved to be looked after. What better way to teach your kids how to behave in both the good and bad times than to be the right role model. I'm still friends with my ex wives and my kids know I looked after them. Win/win in my opinion. We all get to move on........
Best advice ever, don’t get married. Our success rate in Oz isn’t great. Thanks for all the great W/Ls I have met over a long period. Yes I got married after 10yrs, then it lasted 2. It’s like your not going anywhere anymore, what!
johnmatilda
Legend Member
Why do you need to share with an ex wife once the marriage contract is broken? What does she share with you in return? Can you go over for a quick booty call?
No other contract works that way i.e. party A (woman) continues to be rewarded by the hard work of party B (man) despite party B not deriving any benefit from the broken contract. If I am fired from my job, I don't continue to derive a benefit from the company. Why should a man part with half his assets when the woman brought nothing into the relationship? I'm a firm believer that each party should leave with what they brought in and what they individually worked for during the relationship.
I've seen so many men raked over the barrel in divorce court. My perception is based on real life experience. And why teach boys to accept this inequality of surrendering what they spent their lives working for? Why not teach them to be wary of this inequality instead and let them decide if it's a risk they want to take?
You're lucky that you are still friends with your ex wives. I've seen some very vindictive women who have falsely accused their husbands of assault so they can get him arrested and take a VRO so that she can be left in possession of the kids and the house and so they can collect child support. And the man loses his sanity because, as a man, he is presumed guilty and the wife is a delicate petal. I've had to attend court as a witness to verify that I was with a mate of mine at the time he was alleged to have assaulted her. And he still lost half his assets and pays a heck in child support, more than is required to realistically support a child. It's a crazy world out there.
Boys, don't do it. At the very least, understand what you are getting into first and understand that over 50% of marriages end in divorce. If I was told that my parachute had over a 50% of not opening, heck no would I jump out of that plane.
My ex's were stay at home mums. They raised our children when I was absent working overseas creating a life with more choices for everyone. They sacrificed a lot to do that in terms of their own careers and financial self sufficiency. It's fair to share assets. I could not have done what I did in business without their support and they could not have been a homemaker and ever present mum without me. Yes it hurts when you have to sign away $$ in a BFA. BUT....... men can earn it back. What I lost to my ex's I've worked hard to earn back. If they needed money in a crisis I wouldn't hesitate to help. Love is not toxic, it's the lovers that can make it so.
johnmatilda
Legend Member
I want to preface this by saying this is not specifically targeted at you but I am just responding to the situation you described as it raises some important things to be considered by others. If you are happy with the settlement you got, then that's fine.
Now that that is out of the way, I have to say that having to split assets with an ex who was a stay at home mum is a doubly raw deal. Why? Because she received board, food, clothes, a car, holidays, all bills paid and a comfortable life all for zero effort (you may say how can I even say this? I respond by saying how can she take you to the cleaners after all you have done). If she had been a working mum, she would have done most of the things she would have been doing as a stay at home mum anyway but with the added stress brought on by having a job. Winner: stay at home mum.
And despite all the free things she received during the marriage, you now have to part with half your assets that you worked for when the inevitable divorce comes around. And that is despite the very comfortable lifestyle you provided. If anything, such an ex who was looked after during the marriage should say "he is a good man and provided for me during the years of our marriage, I am grateful and I don't want anything, he has done enough". But never a woman has uttered these words when big cash and prizes are involved at the end of the marriage and they will do their best to take as much as they possibly can. A mate of mine lost 3 investment properties to his ex, with zero contribution from her (she was a stay at home mum). Winner: wife.
Conversely, an ex who used to work would have likely contributed to the household expenditure including the mortgage on the house half of which will be surrendered to her upon divorce. So in a way, she gets her half that she contributed to during the marriage (assuming that you both earned equally). This is a far better deal than to have a stay at home wife/mum. Winner: husband and wife (equal contribution equals lesser chances of the divorce turning nasty).
Of course they had to. It was their responsibility to raise the children regardless of your absence or presence (lots of single mums raise children in the absence of the fathers). It is also why the courts give custody to mothers and there has to be very compelling circumstances for the courts not to do so (druggie, abusive etc). Fathers never get commended for raising children and neither should mothers.
What did they really sacrifice though? Not having to go to work and do the daily grind like men do? That is a privilege not a sacrifice. If she won lotto, she would most likely quit her job. If she had been working, it would have been to put food on the table, a shelter over your heads, holidays etc. But as stay at home mums, they already get all that without having to work for it. Me thinks such stay at homes mums should be grateful to have everything provided for them without enduring the daily grind. Winner: wife.
In regards to financial sufficiency, I don't think they sacrificed that by being stay at home mums. They will became self sufficient anyway upon divorce when they take half of your assets that YOU did the daily grind for. Winner: wife.
Why should a man have to share his assets then work hard to earn it back? Most men cannot do so, especially depending on the job, especially if it's a physically demanding job that only gets harder and takes a toll on his body. Many many men have not been able to recover from divorce and from losing their house and other assets. Winner: wife.
This means you are just back to square one and have broken even but have lost time. And why help them with money when they benefitted financially from you upon divorce?
I'm not a believer in love that a woman has for a man. A man is only loved on the condition that he provides something of value. Love is a long dead construct evidenced by high divorce rates. Most divorces are initiated by women.
On a word of caution boys, look up starter husbands. It is often said that men are in love and women are in business.
I've often challenged women to state what benefit a man gets from marriage and none have been able to provide a sensible answer.
TL;DR
Dont get married.
/Sorry for the long post. Hopefully it makes sense as I am doing this late at night.
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O happy, you have been around as long as me lol. I did join around 2006 but got lost in cyber space when the site went down lol. Good to see long term members still putting there opinions forward. Even if you don't get married, same laws apply to defacto relationships. I think we were only put on this planet, because virbrators can't buy a round of drinks. Just Saying Cheers
Well Said lolDon't let that shit phrase fool you boys. It was invented by a wife. You're not a slave to pander to make a wife happy. If she's not happy from within, you can't make her happy from without. And remember that her happiness is not your responsibility but it will be your problem.
Live long and prosper boys
johnmatilda
Legend Member
Vibrators also can't buy houses, cars, take them on holidays, take them to romantic expensive dinners, say nice things to make them feel special, give them half its assets, pay child support and alimony.O happy, you have been around as long as me lol. I did join around 2006 but got lost in cyber space when the site went down lol. Good to see long term members still putting there opinions forward. Even if you don't get married, same laws apply to defacto relationships. I think we were only put on this planet, because virbrators can't buy a round of drinks. Just Saying Cheers
You are a very bitter man who needs to accept that many others are, or were happily married
johnmatilda
Legend Member
Time will tell whether they remain happily married.
For those who were happily married, I wonder why the marriage failed then. If there are big cash and prizes involved in the divorce, rarely is it amicable unless he is willing to roll over. If the man doesn't have much to his name, there isn't much to fight for hence an amicable separation.
As for bitterness, I am a product of my experiences. I have seen relationships turn nasty come divorce and I am merely spreading the truth of what could mostly happen given that most marriages end in divorce.
Ok lol
I accept you are a product of your experiences, which is the case for all of us. I do, however, respectfully think you need to have another look at your statistics. According to the ABS the total number of marriages in Australia in 2022 (Normalised year post COVID) was 127,161. In the same year Divorces were 44,943. Thats only 35.3%. The rates havent changed much since no cause divorces were introduced.
Would be interesting to know how long these marriages lasted. If defacto relationships are the same. Still to many 35.3%. Thanks West for the information. It's good we can all chat here and show respect. Yes we may not always agree with each other. Regards
johnmatilda
Legend Member
Those are the stats for marriages and divorces in 2022. You are looking at it from the wrong point of view as I wasn't speaking of the number of divorces in any one year. I was speaking about the likelihood of getting divorced and the stats say that over 50% of marriages end in divorce. The stats are higher in California where it is 66%. Those are terrible odds for men who lose out in divorce. I won't even take those odds down at the casino let alone with what I have worked hard for in life.
johnmatilda
Legend Member
Keep in mind that the divorce rates appear to be going down because the marriage rate is declining in favour of defacto relationships i.e. no divorce required for defacto relationships but yes, you still have to split assets when the relationship fails.
johnmatilda
Legend Member
And before anyone asks for my source, here it is:
A complete legal guide to Australian divorce rates and statistics
Australian divorce rates and statistics reveal important insights into changing societal beliefs & legislation that shape our relationships.
www.australianfamilylawyers.com.au
StevieG
Legend Member
This is good post, plenty to consider for young men
johnmatilda
Legend Member
And middle and older men as they are the target demographic to be starter husbands.
Well said . Sometimes there thinking with the wrong head. Cheers
"most marriages end in divorce"
I guess at the end of the day it comes down to what you define as "most". Personally I don't think "most" marriages end in divorce. I would be thinking "most" would be well over 50%, more like the Californian rate you quoted.
(The bar graph you attached only measured divorced couples, not all couples. It is an interesting graph, but doesn't measure divorce rates)
I did mention that the divorce rates (excluding the 2 Covid years) were relatively stable according to the ABS. I was wrong. In 2018 it was 42%, in 2019 it was 43% so in fact there are fewer divorces in the latest statistics. So lets be conservative and say that 2022 was a post COVID anomaly and the true rate is around 42 to 43%. "0ver 50%" is a bit of an exaggeration.
At the end of the day those rates are too high, but to blame it all on the wife is a bit of a stretch. Still an interesting discussion.
I am sorry you have had bad experiences, but I know lots of happily married people, who are still in love. Lets not spoil it for the young guys.
I guess at the end of the day it comes down to what you define as "most". Personally I don't think "most" marriages end in divorce. I would be thinking "most" would be well over 50%, more like the Californian rate you quoted.
(The bar graph you attached only measured divorced couples, not all couples. It is an interesting graph, but doesn't measure divorce rates)
I did mention that the divorce rates (excluding the 2 Covid years) were relatively stable according to the ABS. I was wrong. In 2018 it was 42%, in 2019 it was 43% so in fact there are fewer divorces in the latest statistics. So lets be conservative and say that 2022 was a post COVID anomaly and the true rate is around 42 to 43%. "0ver 50%" is a bit of an exaggeration.
At the end of the day those rates are too high, but to blame it all on the wife is a bit of a stretch. Still an interesting discussion.
I am sorry you have had bad experiences, but I know lots of happily married people, who are still in love. Lets not spoil it for the young guys.
johnmatilda
Legend Member
See my posts at #50 and #51 above. If you agree that 42-43% of marriages (registered) end in divorce then considering married and non-married (defacto/unregistered), then the divorce/separation rate surely has to be well above 50% because defacto has to account for a lot more than 7%. As I said, marriage rates are on the decline while defacto is on the incline which is harder to track but see post #51 above.
College educated women initiate 80% of divorces (US stats, I don't have AU stats but can't be too far off). Wives overwhelmingly benefit the most from divorce (they are awarded custody in 98% of cases, alimony paid in 98% of divorces along with involuntary wealth flow from men to women).
Who can we point the finger to then?
Given the above, I would also like to put the onus on women because if they are not part of the solution to divorce unfairness, then they are part of the problem.
Don't blame me for the above in bold, I am merely taking a leaf out of Isiah McKimmie's article:
johnmatilda
Legend Member
I agree, that's why I tell men not to play that game of marriage/defacto.
I am fortunate to have had some vindictive women in my life who taught me a lesson, but I really feel for my mates whose lives have been torn apart by divorce and had to start over again at a late age.
The only way to tell if the marriage was successful is if at least one of the partners in a marriage dies before they get divorced. Then it is said that the marriage lasted until the end.
My intention is not to spoil but to educate. So many of my now divorced mates say they wish they knew that the odds were stacked against them before they got married. I am in a way, fulfilling those wishes for the future generation so that they can make an informed decision.
Max23
Silver Member
Marriage? Now that's a luxury.
Max23
Silver Member
This comes off as immature and childish.
You want all the benefits of a marriage without any of the potential downsides from it not working out. You see women not as people, but objects. Robots that you input you own beliefs, whims and needs into.
You want the woman to be a stay at home homemaker and be left with nothing once you've left her on a whim?
You're not trying to educate anyone. You want to poison the well so more people are just as bitter, angry, lonely and pathetic as you are.
Back in the day women could not get divorces, and were seen as mens property. Do you know what they used to do to get out of abusive marriages with shitheads like you? Hint hint, it wasn't great for the man's health.