Sunday trading , Yes or No ?

[MovesInSilence]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

I use to work sundays and well the only part of it that sucked was the public transport. I had one day a week off so it worked for me
I guess a special event sunday opening should be the way it's done but as Smoggy mentioned the city is open

 

[DT4eva]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

as a driver the public transport the bus and train services are not really that great as we only have limited services running on a Sunday. ie: the bus that runs along Canning hwy runs every 15 mins Monday to Saturday then on a sunday its every 30 mins and the bus goers get so angry with the service as it always runs late on a Sunday.

 

[bushseeker]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

i routinely work every hour imaginable in the last 10 years in many varied jobs
dayshift/nightshift xmas day/NYE /15 hour days 50 days off no break/sat/sun etc etc

i reckon thers some nancy boys who need to HTFU stop whinging and do some work

 

[Petronius]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

Why not let individual shop owners decide if they want to open on Sunday or not?

 

[bushseeker]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

Why not let individual shop owners decide if they want to open on Sunday or not?

it doesnt work like that in centres. if you wont open your shop sundays the cenre manager wont renew your lease and get someone in who will

 

[Petronius]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

it doesnt work like that in centres. if you wont open your shop sundays the cenre manager wont renew your lease and get someone in who will

It does in New Zealand. It's very common there to go into a shopping centre late at night or on a Sunday and see half the shops shuttered and closed. Anyway, wouldn't it be a simpler (and fairer) solution to use tenant protection legislation to solve the problem rather than just banning the whole centre from opening?

 

[Smoggy]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

I think that some valid comments have been made.

Bushseeker is correct in that shopping centre landlords are generally some of the biggest bullies in the corporate world. A small indepenent business will be threatened by a landlord if they don't open when the shopping centre is open even if opening would result in a financial loss to that business.

When a centre opens there are costs associated with cleaners, security, waste disposal, centre management staff, electricity, trolly removal etc which have to be passed onto all the retailers within the centre even if they don't open.

The large organisations like Woolworths and Coles have massive economies of scale so it is not an issue for them. A franchisee within a centre must open otherwise they will probably be in breach of their franchise agreement and could potentially have their business taken off them. Small independent business is at the bottom of the pile and they risk getting kicked out of the centre for not opening.

Perth is very unusual in that it has one of the highest concentrations of shopping centres in the world. To open all shopping centres on a Sunday would force many small shops to close permanently.

 

[SubNymphet]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

i just think major shopping centres should be open... ie. south of the river, booragoon, carosel... north of the river whitfords and galleria or something like that... there need to be some options for shopping...

i like the idea of it being a 'special occasions' opening... although then the people working have to miss out on a long weekend etc...

so many variables... so many options... at least we are going to get the extended trading hours... i MIGHT be able to get to the shops after work now (when it ever happens)... thats on the days i finish before 8pm anyway... arggg

 

[Petronius]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

In a free country business owners are free to open their business's whenever they freely choose, as long as it falls with in legal trading hours.

In a free country, the government shouldn't be dictating what legal trading hours are. Apart from that I agree with your comment completely.

 

[Smoggy]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

A friend of mine operates a franchised business from a small shopping centre north of the river. Last year they didn't open on Boxing day as the were tired after the Christmas rush. They received a breach of contact notification from their franchisor for not opening on that day. Evidently it is very common with some franchises. Last time I spoke with them they were trying to decide if they were going to open this Boxing day or not. If not they expected another "breach".

 

[Petronius]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

Then it comes to history. Why where these regulations created in the first place? The people wanted it.

If trading in Australia wasn't regulated large chains would have been open for 24hrs a day, 7 days a week for years and there would be little if any trading competition left to keep prices fair.
Trading hours and trading locals are regulated to protect you from larger chains using unfair business practices to destroy market competition.

See, that sounds plausible, but it simply has not happened in other places with extended trading. When I was in Melbourne, there were heaps of little shops to choose from, and retail prices were not significantly different to what they were here. In New Zealand, what happened was that the corner shops and other genuine small businesses thrived. Who wants to go to a supermarket for a carton of milk or pack of cigarettes? People still go to local retailers for stuff like that - well, if they get good, friendly, personal service that is.

The only retailers that will suffer if WA gets rid of trading hours are the IGA stores that give you the impersonal mechanistic service and mass-produced low quality product of a big supermarket, at small supermarket prices. Don't get me wrong, there are some great IGA shops out there, but they'd still do well enough with deregulated trading hours. They just have to offer something different.

Can anyone here remember when shops weren't allowed to open on Saturday afternoon? Do you remember the debate before that change went through? The same arguments were used against Saturday afternoon trading. Hands up who wants Saturday afternoon trading to be illegal again.

By the way, the reasons for regulating trading in the first place were the same as the reasons for regulating sex. The "moral guardian" types didn't want people being commercial on the Sabbath.

 

[johnlou]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

this is commonly known as progress ,
not sure if anyone remembers the time when petrol stations were open 6 am to 6 pm monday to friday and 6 am to 1pm on Saturdays , and did u get petrol for your car on a sunday i think not . im not sure if this was the case in WA but it was in QLD , what would you do now ???

times do change for the better or for the worst but it will change

 

[yeahno]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

The public have voted with their feet. Most people just dont want Sunday trading. I thought I would visit a few local shopping centres on Sunday (28th) to gauge the popularity of the extended trading hours. I wasn't surprised by the empty car parks or the empty stores. The traders were unhappy at having to open, the staff were unhappy at having to work and everybody was bored. Nothing to do - very few customers. Even the larger more popular centres were very quiet.
OK I acknowledge that people may be a little shopped out after Christmas. But this Sunday was a real test and it failed miserably. As a society are we so addicted to shopping that we can't have one day off. We are not backward, we have a lifestyle that many envy. We can worship at Church or at the footy, we can go to the beach or for a drive. And yes, we can shop in the City, Fremantle or Rockingham etc if we want. We are not backward, we are leading the way.

Western Australia - a great place to live.

Fully agree. There is no need for it. Being a manager at a well known supermarket I would quiet happily quit if we had to trade every Sunday. I worked on the 28th and it was the biggest load of bollocks.

There is only a certain amount of shopping people can do and having extended trade will not increase sales for businesses.

 

[yeahno]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

i routinely work every hour imaginable in the last 10 years in many varied jobs
dayshift/nightshift xmas day/NYE /15 hour days 50 days off no break/sat/sun etc etc

i reckon thers some nancy boys who need to HTFU stop whinging and do some work

:laughing4

:violent5:

 

[stormline]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

hi all this has never been an issue for me as you can shop in freo from 12pm,coles,wolworths,target ect are all open.so i guess its where you live.why is freo aloud to have it but nowhere north from here,go south you can.wtf goes on??i personally beleive that coles and now the new woolworths get very busy on a sunday arvo.

 

[Largess_love]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

WOW what a can of worms!!
I moved from the eastern states where in the cities we had 7 day trading. The supermarkets depending on suburbs were open 24/7 others till midnight and open again 7am 7 days a week. I took that for granted
I moved into a small rural are and backwards to supermarket trading from8.30am to 6pm 7 days a week but other stores till lunch sat and no sunday ...god I thought that was backward. THEN I MOVED TO PERTH!!
It seemed so backwards compared to every capital city in Australia. And IGA must love trading over in WA as they certainly charge pretty high prices!!
bottle shops even close early lol

I THOUGHT HOW COULD WA BE SO BEHIND THE REST OF AUSTRALIA

Well I went back east for a time and guess what............

SMOGGY your right

WA is ahead of everyone else!! I couldnt wait to get back to somewhere where people enjoy family time or time out on sundays just drive around the city and suburbs the parks ar full of people...cant do that when mum and dad work weekends.

I was looking from the wrong perspective its not backwards at all it about the people being individuals who do care, and yes we can arrange ourselves around no sunday trading..............BUT................
please have longer hours during the week for supermarkets such as woolworths and coles so the majority of workers can get their shopping done spread out through the week. The one thing I know I hated when working full time in retail was having to shop on a saturday when everyman and his dog were there. If I could have done it one the way home or late at night like I had done for past 10 (plus) years it would have been better.

 

[OZYGIRL]

Afraid that since I work most of the hours 6 days a week that the shops are open here I rely on Sundays to do stuff like groceries etc.

 

[flange gasket]

Nice loaded questions by the way.

Cant say I'm a fan of 7 day shopping as we don't really have the population density just yet. I reckon when the population gets to the 2 million mark, let's look at it. I like to have a respite from the rampant consumerism of modern living. I think it's why we have a sunday session here in Perth, there's no such thing over east.

I AM in favour of a an hour extension to trading hours either side of the current times during the week (7am-7pm mon, tues, wed and friday, 7am-9pm thurs). The current hours are way too restrictive.

 

[paul78]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

Then it comes to history. Why where these regulations created in the first place? The people wanted it.

If trading in Australia wasn't regulated large chains would have been open for 24hrs a day, 7 days a week for years and there would be little if any trading competition left to keep prices fair.
Trading hours and trading locals are regulated to protect you from larger chains using unfair business practices to destroy market competition.

Why is keeping business's open 24hr's a day, 7days a week considered progress?

I doubt it. I work in a mining town where there is a high proportion of shift workers, and the two supermarkets were asked by the company to open 24/7. They did but stopped it due to lack of interest. Now they open til ~8, which suits the shifties like me who work 6 til 6. When I do go back to Perth its a pain in the **** that the shops shut so early. I think it would be great if they were allowed to stay open longer. I despise how the government wants to control everything, ranging from censorship (except the sensible such as child pornography) to the proposal that we have national id cards. I do love the deceitfulness in how they have said the cards will be "voluntary", the catch being if you need to deal with a government department you will be required to have one. Try to find one person who hasn't dealt with medicare/centrelink at least once! Capitalism is far from perfect, but the consumers will dictate the opening hours, and I would be very suprised if shops found it profitable to stay open past 9pm. The only customers would probably be those teenagers who steal and vandalise more then buy.:laughing4

 

[Reggie]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

I'm not sure I can believe this argument that if you don't open on Sunday that the 'powers that be' will drive you out of business. I live South of the river and I cannot go into a shopping centre that doesn't have empty shops "For Lease" and, as was mentioned earlier, a landlords greatest fear is not getting rent.

Can you believe that with all the pro's and con's that surround this issue that someone would have to go to the Global Warming argument to make a point, my God, if I break a shoelace it is the fault of car exhaust and cow farts. Please.

 

[Cavesquig]

Yawn ... come to Perth , we not only hate sunlight , we hate the shops being open , hey lets bring back the roster system for fuel , dont know what took you so long to get rid of that one but I know some must be itching for its return , I am suprised your airport is open 24/7 , even Heathrow isnt , maybe you should work on that one , keep those pesky tourists away hey ! I know a lot of Perth people want to leave the dark ages but to many are holding you back , hey who remembers when the street lights use to go out at 1.15 am in Perth and Alfreds kitchen was the only place you could buy take away after the local chippy had shut , bring it back hey , God help us ....BNB . :nono:

Petrol rosters, lights out at 1;15 and no late night fast food....................I remember those days....

On the plus side.........petrol was under 50 cents a litre

 

[JayMax]

Nothing shits me off more than when you go over east, you can hit a Coles or Woolies at 9pm and still get your groceries. Why the hell cant we get this too?!?

 

[Naughty Thoughts]

And WA is the only (I think) state which doesn't have extended trading and things are more expensive here than over east.

Don't forget to also factor in additional costs like longer transport distances!

As paul78 said - the shops will determine what times it is profitable to trade and what hours aren't.

I say, total deregulation and let capitalism work it out. Where I work we open quite late on Thursdays and guess what - we have about three customers between seven and close. Such late trading is fine for our stores over east, but we don't get any customers at any of the stores over here.

On the plus side, we get paid to stand around doing nothing.

 

[Petronius]

I say, total deregulation and let capitalism work it out.

I completely support this view. I don't see why the government is making decisions that should be made by individual shop managers. After all, if it really isn't profitable to open extra hours then you won't find many shops willing to deliberately lose money by doing so. It's just that by legislating, the government is taking the option away from those who want to try it - and that's wrong, in my opinion.

 

[JAB1982]

Oh god yes we need Sunday trading. I can't believe that in this day and age we aren't allowed to shop on Sunday. Whoever says that the small independents will miss out if we open the major's on Sunday is fooling themselves. They are just supporting high prices that are able to be charged by these shops due to their monopoly of Sunday trading.

 

[Minxxy]

I dont understand how people can say that extended trade will lead to the death of small business...

Over east there are thousands of small businesses that operate successfully while the bigger shops are open 'extended hours'. So why would WA be any different?

Extended trade will increase job numbers, and people will have more opportunity to shop at times that are convenient to them. There is nothing compulsory to say that shops MUST open but it is about choice.

 

[bushseeker]

There is nothing compulsory to say that shops MUST open but it is about choice.

not quite true Minxxy - many shopping centres dictate when the shops have to be open - sure you dont HAVE to comply but then they dont HAVE to renew your lease either

 

[Bratboy]

we aren't allowed to shop on Sunday

Why aren't you allowed to? There's things open, just not everything.

I don't think we have the population density to support 24/7 shopping.

 

[Bratboy]

Re: Public Reject Sunday Trading

WOW what a can of worms!!
I moved from the eastern states where in the cities we had 7 day trading. The supermarkets depending on suburbs were open 24/7 others till midnight and open again 7am 7 days a week. I took that for granted
I moved into a small rural are and backwards to supermarket trading from8.30am to 6pm 7 days a week but other stores till lunch sat and no sunday ...god I thought that was backward. THEN I MOVED TO PERTH!!
It seemed so backwards compared to every capital city in Australia. And IGA must love trading over in WA as they certainly charge pretty high prices!!
bottle shops even close early lol

I THOUGHT HOW COULD WA BE SO BEHIND THE REST OF AUSTRALIA

Well I went back east for a time and guess what............

SMOGGY your right

WA is ahead of everyone else!! I couldnt wait to get back to somewhere where people enjoy family time or time out on sundays just drive around the city and suburbs the parks ar full of people...cant do that when mum and dad work weekends.

I was looking from the wrong perspective its not backwards at all it about the people being individuals who do care, and yes we can arrange ourselves around no sunday trading..............BUT................
please have longer hours during the week for supermarkets such as woolworths and coles so the majority of workers can get their shopping done spread out through the week. The one thing I know I hated when working full time in retail was having to shop on a saturday when everyman and his dog were there. If I could have done it one the way home or late at night like I had done for past 10 (plus) years it would have been better.

I like this post. I moved here from over east and love the relaxed lifestyle we enjoy.

Never heard of a Sunday sesh until I got here.

I'm getting a bit bored of the "backward" comments that people make about WA all the time. We don't have poker machines either, perhaps that's progress as well considering everyone else has them.

Just because everyone else is doing something, doesn't make it good.

 

[JAB1982]

Why aren't you allowed to? There's things open, just not everything.

I don't think we have the population density to support 24/7 shopping.

We may not have the population density to support 24/7 shopping but we do have the population to support shops being open 7 days a week. Have you been to a shopping centre on a Sunday when it is open, it is packed and while this may not be sustained at such a high level if we were to allow Sunday trading on a permanent basis, it would be high enough to support shops opening.

I think the choice for consumers to shop if they want to is the biggest issue here. As said before, the eastern states have Sunday trading and there is still plenty of small business, so I don't think we will have a problem. If anything it will help business especially in such a tough economic environment as we are facing at the moment.